tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2462026865900537983.post3875249457516583674..comments2023-08-28T01:47:52.421-07:00Comments on United Hollywood: AMPTP Tactics Don't Fool AnybodyUnknownnoreply@blogger.comBlogger42125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2462026865900537983.post-86091035171169977642007-12-11T18:46:00.000-08:002007-12-11T18:46:00.000-08:00I'm curious. If they run Internet programming thr...I'm curious. If they run Internet programming through cable into our homes, is that Internet (new, hopefully good deal) or is it cable (old, bad deal)?JimBobhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06243598532867625750noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2462026865900537983.post-9179856422232479332007-12-11T16:11:00.000-08:002007-12-11T16:11:00.000-08:00PS - For some reason dollar signs post as capital ...PS - For some reason dollar signs post as capital "s". But I mean money, dollars , cold hard cash.hollarbackhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00759689530670606301noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2462026865900537983.post-57433647138024401632007-12-11T16:08:00.000-08:002007-12-11T16:08:00.000-08:00Chuckt, your arguments all seem to hinge on the fo...Chuckt, your arguments all seem to hinge on the formula of how money is made in the entertainment biz never changing. But it will. It is. Look how the means of delivery has changed in just a year. Fact is, the writers will continue to strike, and eventually they will win just compensation and a fair contract. <BR/><BR/>I am not a writer, I am a consumer, one of those people you claimed "did not care" about the writers strike. Guess what? I care. And I am not watching any reality replacement crap in the New Year, nor am I buying any DVDs this Christmas. The AMPTP is a supplier and financier; they do not create the product that I wish to watch. They might as well be the milk man showing up at my door; they aren’t the cow. Frankly, I am appalled at the way that they treat those who work for and with them. It is very obvious that they fired all of the crew people in order to stir up discord; that is the first move management makes in any labor strike. Me, well I choose to vote with my SSS. As in BOYCOTT. That means products advertised on the networks too. The AMPTP are clearly bullies, and no high priced PR firm can white wash that away. No one likes a bully.hollarbackhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00759689530670606301noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2462026865900537983.post-80933846987289661302007-12-11T13:33:00.000-08:002007-12-11T13:33:00.000-08:00Chuck,Thanks for playing.Next.Chuck,<BR/><BR/>Thanks for playing.<BR/><BR/>Next.Calibanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14045677407756491258noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2462026865900537983.post-79504769152153195212007-12-11T12:35:00.000-08:002007-12-11T12:35:00.000-08:00Chuck T wrote:"It's my understanding that the WGA ...Chuck T wrote:<BR/>"It's my understanding that the WGA is demanding jurisdiction over original content created for the internet. I don't think anyone is going to disagree that the producers and writers need to reach a better consensus on "promotional use". But to demand jurisdiction over original content is really to everyone's detriment"<BR/><BR/>Your point about figuring out a new and better way to slice up the pie of original content on the internet, only reinforces why WGA needs to establish jurisdiction over the arena now. Whatever system is devised to pay writers doesn't mean a thing if WGA doesn't establish itself as the representative of those writers. AMPTP isn't going to give up jurisdiction to WGA after a system is created. Their argument about original content isn't about how writers are paid, rather their argument is WGA shouldn't be the union repping writers of original content at all. Also, writers of original content created for the internet for the media congloms will only have a more difficult time establishing collective bargaining from this point on. WGA is hardly being shortsighted in taking on this fight now in protecting not only its current membership in this arena, but the writers of the future.Carrie Vhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17541011952386351550noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2462026865900537983.post-59037163573314586022007-12-11T12:21:00.000-08:002007-12-11T12:21:00.000-08:00Dan @ The Writers' Building,Who said anything abou...Dan @ The Writers' Building,<BR/><BR/>Who said anything about submitting a report? And no shit the companies have done the numbers crunching (duh-duh-duh). But what they HAVEN'T done is figured out the revenue model that EVERYBODY (advertisers, producers and artists) believes is going to make the internet the BIG PAYDAY (you know, the very thing you all are striking for - certainly, you're not striking for the few dimes you'll be getting from downloaded scripted content).<BR/><BR/>You missed the point entirely but that doesn't surprise me because so has the WGA as a whole. Who needs to you submit numbers? The numbers have ALREADY been done. This isn't about you refuting the numbers the producers have come up with, it's about taking what they have and using it to solve a very REAL problem regarding new media (my god, you can't tell me that you're so cut off from business that you don't understand the fact that everyone is trying to grasp the monetization of the technology which is moving quicker than our minds can grasp the situation). <BR/><BR/>I guarantee you that when the Directors sit down with the Producers, they will TOGETHER figure out a piece of this puzzle that the writers (in that romantic, head-in-the-clouds way that they do) have completely missed. Just try, for the sake of your own cause, to be a business person (and, yes, a ruthless business person). Put yourself in the shoes of the producers and try to figure out what is keeping them from getting their goal. They'll be MUCH more likely to help you reach yours. THAT is actually the number one basic tactic of negotiation.ChuckThttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08186077762162381967noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2462026865900537983.post-11810373941290371672007-12-11T10:13:00.000-08:002007-12-11T10:13:00.000-08:00Chuck,it's naive to think that the corporations ha...Chuck,<BR/>it's naive to think that the corporations haven't done estimates on how much they stand to gain on internet delivery. And it's also naive to think that the AMPTP would ACCEPT any report the WGA had commissioned and presented to them. They haven't accepted any of the WGA's numbers yet, why start now? That's a basic tactic of negotiation, not to agree on firm numbers; the minute they do, they prove that they are, in fact, making a profit on digital delivery. Which we KNOW because there's much evidence out there of sales figures and reports to Wall Street. Again, your whole "NO ONE KNOWS ANYTHING ABOUT THIS CRAZY WILD WEST KNOWN AS THE INTERNETS AND THE STUDIOS ARE JUST WAITING FOR THE WGA TO GIVE THEM A COMPREHENSIVE RESEARCH REPORT" holds no water and is naive.Dan @ The Writers' Buildinghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12552886762024915833noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2462026865900537983.post-17969218196527407192007-12-11T06:48:00.000-08:002007-12-11T06:48:00.000-08:00Dan @ The Writers' Building ,It's my understanding...Dan @ The Writers' Building ,<BR/><BR/>It's my understanding that the WGA is demanding jurisdiction over original content created for the internet. I don't think anyone is going to disagree that the producers and writers need to reach a better consensus on "promotional use". But to demand jurisdiction over original content is really to everyone's detriment. The internet is an open-market free for all. Negotiating the internet as if it were merely an extension of tv and film is disastrous. The studios are going to make money off of downloaded scripted content in ways that the Writers are not even considering. At some point, the WGA is going to realize that but, by then, it will be too late (IF they keep going down this road). <BR/>In order to really get a piece of any action, you have to AT LEAST figure out a huge piece of the revenue puzzle and throw it on the table as a solution to the way content can be even more effectively monetized and as the basis for negotiations (no one - not even the producers - has done that yet - but the writers stand to lose a lot more by not trying). It will do the WGA well to take these next few months (while you're on strike) to try to figure out that crucial element - it's the only way you would be able to come out on top and get the respect from the producers at the bargaining table. Otherwise, you're just demanding a piece of an increasingly frustrating and difficult-to-solve problem and that's a main part of the reason the studios are being inflexible and resent even having the discussion/negotiations. They feel the Directors will be more business-centric in helping them figure it out (and they’re probably right).ChuckThttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08186077762162381967noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2462026865900537983.post-47487030902534137122007-12-11T01:30:00.000-08:002007-12-11T01:30:00.000-08:00It's good to see that there are more people voicin...It's good to see that there are more people voicing their opinions and that their posts are not being removed. <BR/><BR/>It's pretty obvious that even those who don't agree with the strike can see that the issue is with the new media and the formula for new media residuals.<BR/><BR/>Then why is the WGA holding so tightly to the issues of Reality (which won't hold up in court anyway), Animation (which is covered mostly by IATSE), and the no strike clause? (the third party valuation item should be included in the actual new media residual contract language). <BR/><BR/>The whole idea of negotiations is to be at the table (not at the rally) so can anyone convince me why these items should be and are deal breakers for the WGA? Why are these issues what's keeping everyone away from the table? <BR/><BR/>Is it because of pride, or feeling like WGA gave in to their demands? Who cares? I haven't seen much debate on this site about how you need to fight to maintain the right to strike with other unions. It's all been about residuals. Why are the other items still on the table?<BR/><BR/>For the record - there's so much he said she said back and forth - here's an idea: The WGA seems to be prolific with You Tube and wants to be on the internet cutting edge. How about putting the negotiations on the net? CSPAN style. <BR/><BR/>Let's see just how both sides' leadership is behaving. Let's see who arrives late and just who is at the table and for how long. Hold these people responsible to WGA and everyone affected. WGA can keep the private meeting rooms private (or put them on the members only part of the site) but the negotiating table should be made available to all of us. It's just that important.<BR/><BR/>That's my vent for today.RIP WGAhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03231814496980058176noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2462026865900537983.post-12732227758739973552007-12-10T23:26:00.000-08:002007-12-10T23:26:00.000-08:00Why dont the writers work without a contract, shit...Why dont the writers work without a contract, shit I bet only 20% of their people are active staff on jobs at the moment...<BR/><BR/>www.writerssuck.compat crackshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00382614368373256409noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2462026865900537983.post-70213833914857124682007-12-10T23:23:00.000-08:002007-12-10T23:23:00.000-08:00"They CANNOT and WILL NOT let you walk away from t..."They CANNOT and WILL NOT let you walk away from the eventual settlement of these negotiations with your spirit and organization in tact. If they did, it would be their biggest business mistake in decades."<BR/><BR/>Why is that? Remember Henry Ford, the visionary car maker who realized that it served his interest for his employees to make enough money to afford to buy the product they made? Why does it have to be a zero-sum game? We're talking about twisted personalities who think that if they don't get to keep ALL the marbles, then they have somehow lost. It's a sickness.<BR/><BR/>"It's in the producer's best interest to break the WGA's back and watch the guild die a slow death."<BR/><BR/>Why? We're not trying to take away their Gulfstreams or their homes in Aspen. The guild provides security for and continuity of an important source of input to their income stream. What does breaking us get them, exactly? Be specific.JimBobhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06243598532867625750noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2462026865900537983.post-86077579336000718302007-12-10T23:21:00.000-08:002007-12-10T23:21:00.000-08:00This comment has been removed by the author.JimBobhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06243598532867625750noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2462026865900537983.post-23285925414607930022007-12-10T23:19:00.001-08:002007-12-10T23:19:00.001-08:00This comment has been removed by the author.JimBobhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06243598532867625750noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2462026865900537983.post-18276658695946761012007-12-10T23:19:00.000-08:002007-12-10T23:19:00.000-08:00ChuckT, I don't understand where you're getting th...ChuckT, <BR/>I don't understand where you're getting this claim of the WGA wanting "jurisdiction" over all creative content on the web. Perhaps you're talking about the issue of "promotional use." Well, if the studios would provide a reasonable, specific and CLEAR definition of promotional then both parties would be in a much better position to negotiate on the issue. I agree that writers don't necessarily have to be paid a residual for every banner ad placed online that contains video footage, but that's something that needs to be discussed and defined...if only the AMPTP would allow that to happen.Dan @ The Writers' Buildinghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12552886762024915833noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2462026865900537983.post-27780927864501031162007-12-10T21:02:00.000-08:002007-12-10T21:02:00.000-08:00Gavin Palone, (if it's really you and.. I highly d...Gavin Palone, (if it's really you and.. I highly doubt it) it seems like you would be far busier commenting to people on this board who really need the pep talk. I don't work for the studio or the writers or some producer or a studio head. It really boggles the mind that you industry people seem to think you're the only ones entitled to an informed opinion. It's also fairly sad. Wow... just... wow. They don't call it La-La Land for nothin'. There's a whole world out there folks full people who DON'T work in your field who also have opinions (gasp) that will even differ (sometimes strongly) from yours (double-gasp!). <BR/><BR/>**********************************<BR/><BR/>Dan @ The Writers' Building,<BR/><BR/>The WGA is demanding jurisdiction over the internet (including original content created for the web). I'd call that a HUGE piece of the pie. <BR/><BR/>This fight is about the internet pot of gold in the very near future. Everyone (including the writers and producers) knows and readily admits that the money being made off of downloaded scripted content today is a drop in the bucket compared to the potential revenue to be made on the internet. Your statistics are lovely but nobody (not even Europeans) have figured out how to turn those numbers into money anywhere NEAR comparable to what Hollywood is used to (or, rather, how to milk the full revenue potential from the internet). Downloaded scripted shows is very small piece of the internet pie (though, obviously, one the writers deserve). But ORIGINAL content created for the web is another ball game all together.ChuckThttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08186077762162381967noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2462026865900537983.post-41624032403297662982007-12-10T17:45:00.000-08:002007-12-10T17:45:00.000-08:00I didn't sling anything at you, genius. You're cr...I didn't sling anything at you, genius. You're crazy.PootieTwohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12631616790049558825noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2462026865900537983.post-80826588242776438532007-12-10T17:40:00.000-08:002007-12-10T17:40:00.000-08:00Geez, what a a-hole!:)Geez, what a a-hole!<BR/><BR/>:)B.G.https://www.blogger.com/profile/01273483779146530920noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2462026865900537983.post-29209141715173814272007-12-10T16:20:00.000-08:002007-12-10T16:20:00.000-08:00To ChuckT and not-a-troll and pootietwo and any ot...To ChuckT and not-a-troll and pootietwo and any other BTL naysayers and shit slingers: The WGA is genuinely sorry for your plight, but they are not going to let themselves get screwed for another 20 years just because you guys are out of work. They're depriving their employers of what the employers need in order to get what they themselves need. It's the only leverage they've got. Sorry to say, you're not even in the equation.<BR/><BR/>Let me say that again: You're not relevant to the negotiation -- which among other things means you can all stop posting now. Everyone knows how much you're hurting, but the writers aren't going to go back to work until they get a just contract.<BR/><BR/>Remember too that the WGA didn't lay you off, your studio employers did. And they can bring you back any time they want. <BR/><BR/>Meanwhile, you accepted the possibility of work stoppages such as this one when you took a job in this field. Hopefully you took the necessary responsibility for that eventuality when you did.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02727844970409204778noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2462026865900537983.post-27473094481203585742007-12-10T15:59:00.000-08:002007-12-10T15:59:00.000-08:00Not a Troll - Keep on keeping on, you crack me up....Not a Troll - Keep on keeping on, you crack me up. I love how you can tell how the picketlines feel while driving past a studio with several gates which are all being picketed. Yes, the writers are SO beaten down. <BR/><BR/>Chuckt - Everyone knows that professionally produced content is what people go to the internet for. Ask any 15 year old. The best and most popular youtube stuff is clips of scripted shows. Your argument holds no water;Europe already streams most of its written content and they also compensate their talent for internet use and reuse. So it can be done...it already has been.<BR/><BR/>Scripted content is alive and well dumkoff. Check out TV in Germany, it's scripted, it's online and it's here...right now. The US studios and networks are lagging.hollarbackhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00759689530670606301noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2462026865900537983.post-57439969471317772942007-12-10T15:57:00.000-08:002007-12-10T15:57:00.000-08:00not-a-troll ~ did you happen to drive by fox on fr...not-a-troll ~ did you happen to drive by fox on friday? between 400-500 people there. true, not all were writers, but pointing to one day and saying that it represents the average turnout is just silly. some where between 10 and 400 would be a bit more fair of an esitimate, no? and if we are going to do straight averages, instead of medians to represent things (hey, isn't the AMPTP fond of that tactic?) than i would say 205 people per picket line isn't bad at all.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08732755037511104132noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2462026865900537983.post-9798045095433259212007-12-10T15:30:00.000-08:002007-12-10T15:30:00.000-08:00Chuck, a friend just sent me this story about a su...Chuck, <BR/>a friend just sent me this story about a survey that confirms that the most popular content online comes from network TV. Yes, it's only one survey, but everyone knows that "Heroes" and U2 get downloaded more from iTunes than your nephew's garage band and that video of you jumping the trash cans on your scooter. And who's benefiting from that? Major corporations. Sure, there's always the possibility that a guy can walk in off the street and create the next "Ask a Ninja" website or the next "Blair Witch" feature, but how often does it really happen and how hard do you think the corporations are working to make sure it does NOT happen anymore in the future? (e.g., News Corp. buying MySpace, etc.) Writers are only asking for a small piece of the pie, not the entire pie, and as explained to you many times, if they don't put their ass out there in the wind NOW, then 20 years will go by and they'll be in the exact same situation as they are now with DVDs. It's called "no pain, no gain," corporate shillster, you should try it sometime. Excerpts...<BR/>**NEW YORK -- A majority of adult Internet users watch video online during a typical week, with TV programming ranking as the most popular content, according to a survey set to be released Monday.<BR/><BR/>The survey, conducted by the Cambridge, Mass.-based Web personalization firm Choicestream, found that 55% of those surveyed watch online video each week, with 65% of that group reporting that they regularly watch traditional TV programming. Overall, 39% of respondents said they watch TV on an alternate device, with the computer by far the most popular nontraditional method.<BR/><BR/>Twenty% of consumers said they would watch more online TV during the next six months, with 55% of that group saying that would come at the expense of traditional TV viewing.<BR/><BR/>As expected, online video viewing is higher among younger respondents, with 66% of those between ages 18-24 saying they watch online video and about 70% of respondents ages 18-34 saying they watch TV on the Web.<BR/><BR/>A majority of online TV viewers watch an hour or more per week as well. Thirty-four% of consumers said they watch one to three hours per week and 33% said they watch at least four hours.<BR/><BR/>User-generated content was a distant second to TV in terms of what respondents watch online, with fewer than 40% saying that they regularly watch that type of material. Consumers ages 18-24 watch the most, with about 45% responding that they regularly watch online user-generated content.**Dan @ The Writers' Buildinghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12552886762024915833noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2462026865900537983.post-9009423081014513592007-12-10T15:20:00.000-08:002007-12-10T15:20:00.000-08:00Wow, chuckt, that comment works in just about the ...Wow, chuckt, that comment works in just about the entire AMPTP strategy. DUN DUN DUUUUUN! Pretty soon, we're going to be able to start a drinking game based on it.foolproof planhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01644847540504879137noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2462026865900537983.post-48136924040641295312007-12-10T14:46:00.000-08:002007-12-10T14:46:00.000-08:00Caliban said... To Chuck T, There's some tru...Caliban said...<BR/><BR/> To Chuck T,<BR/><BR/> There's some truth to what you say but it does not dampen our resolve - instead it ratchets it up. This is a last effort by the old guard of the AMPTP to show they still have teeth - they're doing what's always worked before but they don't realize that things have changed and they've been left behind.<BR/>****************<BR/><BR/>It wasn't said to dampen your resolve. I gain nothing in dampening your resolve. But it makes no sense that the WGA led you writers into this strike with your asses wide open and in the air. The fact of the matter is the new business model won't tolerate your egos OR the producers' inflexibility in defining "talent". <BR/><BR/>As far as your statement regarding the AMPTP not realizing things have changed and being left behind - well over a year ago the Producers/Studios started moving their assets onto the internet, investing across platforms and in different ventures on the internet so that they can have a presence NOW for WHATEVER the internet will be in the FUTURE. Why haven't you writers or the WGA done the same?<BR/><BR/>It looks like the writers are the ones who have fallen behind.ChuckThttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05972033656534702763noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2462026865900537983.post-79573892932810506752007-12-10T14:28:00.000-08:002007-12-10T14:28:00.000-08:00To Chuck T,There's some truth to what you say but ...To Chuck T,<BR/><BR/>There's some truth to what you say but it does not dampen our resolve - instead it ratchets it up. This is a last effort by the old guard of the AMPTP to show they still have teeth - they're doing what's always worked before but they don't realize that things have changed and they've been left behind. They're kind of like the old mafia guys in Godfather 2 who want Michael to invest his money in Cuban gambling - after he's seen the will of the rebels and decides this is a fight the old guard won't win. <BR/><BR/>It'll take a smart studio head or a younger more forward looking representative of the AMPTP to realize there's no point throwing good money after bad. They'll make a fair deal because the stakes are as high as the best movie we can write - and the consequence of not doing so is the worst ending they can imagine.Calibanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14045677407756491258noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2462026865900537983.post-29611185159870323762007-12-10T14:03:00.000-08:002007-12-10T14:03:00.000-08:00It's true. I have not been happy about this situat...It's true. I have not been happy about this situation. I had a few question that I wanted to ask. That ought to be an okay thing to do when you lose your job. Ask questions. Despite all my question, I was rooting for the writers. But now I just feel so alienated. I don't want to hate the writers. It sure didn't start out that way. I hate corporations! But I'll be damned if we haven't been repeatedly insulted and accused on this site. You don't dare ask questions here. It's too bad. This is not a very good forum for an open discussion, I'm afraid.PootieTwohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12631616790049558825noreply@blogger.com